(P.S. Penny i went to that website about hedwig and i must say it was pretty stupid.)

Just saw the fifth movie (my husband took me for my birthday Monday), and it was the best by far. It surprised me, actually, how much foreshadowing made it in … but then, recent interviews have proven taht the actors know much more about their characters tahn we did.

Great job, you guys — keep it up!

Also, I never look at a series of movies to give me the hidden meanings, or non-hidden meanings that are all over the books. You’ll notice we *never* get the boy gross-out humor in the movies. It’s all homogenized out. Thank goodness. Just wait, we won’t get the “doing up the zipper by hand” line either. These are the pieces we only get because we read the books.

On the other hand, we’re not getting children’s stories either. My niece was scared for the entirety of the Ministry of Magic scene, especially when Harry was being possessed, a la The Exorcist. That even freaked me out.

She was also scared during the Mermaid and Graveyard scenes in 4, and considers that one scarier than 5 (whatever). Even the first three have their moments. She still jumps when Harry touches the Hand of Glory in 2. That’s because I scare her every time, but it wouldn’t work if she wasn’t into the movie.

I can’t and refuse to worry about the movies. I have no control over how they turn out, but I’ve been very happy so far with them. I like each successive movie more than the last (save a bit in my heart for the first). I know the people working on the films are as involved as we are, so I trust them to give us an emotional journey. They’re not as obsessed as we are, but they do the manual labor, so in some ways they are more obsessed.

Peter Pettigrew was good (better) in the company of Harry. He is a person whose morals are dependent on his company. He was good when he was a Marauder, a pet rat, etc. He is just a self-serving crumb when left alone or in the company of Death Eaters. Like so many Congressmen who are prone to Lobbyists, this guy is evil by apathy.

Is anyone else a bit heartbroken that Neville’s parents didn’t get any kind of a cure? I’m sure that Neville’s dottiness was a result of PTSD or a charm. My “disney” side wanted this to resolve for Neville.

Greasy haired, grey underpanted, shy, dark, Severus enjoys being the bully he never got to be in school. Now he’s a teacher. Tell me that none of you know a teacher who does this. It’s wrong, but it’s true.

Mizz Andy: Snape was capable of love. He could never be a death-eater because of that! Yes he has a redeeming quality, LOVE. He loved Harry, not for the eyes, but because he knew that Harry had his mom’s personality and kindness. Like Mrs. Figg, part of his cruelty was cover. He enjoyed it because of Harry’s resemblance to James.

Aaron: Yeah, half-rotted Bathilda must have been RANK!

Everyone: I want this shot in the final movie. Harry’s eyes meet Snape’s. Harry morphs into Lily who takes Severus’ hand and leads him onto the train in “Kings Cross”.

Everyone: Why on earth did the movie people cast John Clease then cut the Deathday Party. That is sheer stupidity!

in short Eeyore I agree with you!

More importantly than the director is the screen writer, wouldn’t it be great to see JK write the script herself?

I think it is important that we see Snape give the memories to Harry rather than Harry get them through other means. As I have said above to me this was a important part in Snape’s role, he could’ve just died with Harry never knowing why he had done it or even that he had been loyal to DD. Anyway not going to start on that again.

I love the books more and enjoy the movies, though they always irritate me with the deleted portions. Reading DH, I kept thinking–oh, they’re going to regret leaving that bit out of the movies.

I suppose they could have Harry do Legilimency on Snape to get the memories, but it was so much more powerful that Snape willingly gave Harry the memories, and with such insistance that he take them. Hermione and Ron were with Harry in the Shrieking Shack when Snape was killed and gave Harry the memories–it was Hermione who conjured the flask to contain them.

When Harry saw the memories in Dumbledore’s Pensieve though, I think he was alone; they went back to the Great Hall, where they saw those who had died and been brought in. Hemione went to comfort Ginny, and Ron joined the rest of his family. Harry ran to Dumbledore’s old office with the flask of Snape’s memories, and then after seeing them, he runs into Neville and charges him with destroying Nagini, and he goes towards the Forest. The scene where Ron and Hermione are with him is after it’s all over and they are in the headmaster’s office, and Harry speaks to Dumbledore’s portrait about what happened with the Stone and what his intentions are.

My hope for the movies, now that we have the last book and the end of the story, is that the directors will realize that the movies need to be more than just children’s adventure stories–even at this late date they can include the personal journey that Harry makes that has nothing to do with Quidditch and action packed battles.

But I’m afraid they just won’t do justice to The Prince’s Tale or to The Forest Again and King’s Cross. So all the people who just watch the movies won’t get the full and important impact of the books, especially the last one, nor why all those deaths are so important.

I agree. I also found there were several gory parts in this book that almost had it reading like a horror novel. It has also affected my rereading of the series. The horror of the snake makes everything seem nastier.

At first blush, all of Snape’s Lily issues are problematic for the DH movie. However I believe they shot the worst memory scene, then cut it from the movie. In OoTP, Harry’s issue with the memory was that his dad was a big jerk, and really not much else. If they did shoot the whole scene, we might be able to see it in full at some point, maybe, in DH, where the actual worst part of the memory is important. The movie didn’t really concern itself with Harry’s angst about James, so why even bother with that. This memory for the films is really only important because of Lily in DH anyway, so I think it’s entirety became expendable to forward Harry’s journey.

The movies don’t spend too much time with forshadowing the other books or movies unless they do it accidentally (and sometimes very well, see Neville finding the Room of Requirement for the DA). I keep thinking they’ll just have Harry do Legilimency on Snape when he dies instead of the memory dump and the race to the Headmaster’s office. And maybe he’ll be alone instead of Ron and Hermione being with him. That would be a convenient way for him to go straight from Snape’s death to the forest. There doesn’t seem to be a big problem with switching orders of events in the movies, so I’m not really worried about it.

remember Snape was fascinated by the dark arts either way..

I dont think James was a “dick”..I think he was arrogant, coming from an extremely pampered background and into a school where he was well liked and good at things — he was just a snob…but remember he accepted and cared about people even if they were 1. from a family that was known for being obsessed with blood purity (the blacks) or 2. a werewolf ….he could not have been that awful..pompous jerk I will agree with though..

As readers we tend to draw ourselves to a character and see them as a specific way. Snape would not have cared about the rest of the wizarding world or really anybody if Voldemort hadn’t gone after Lily…that is why Snape isnt still a “good guy” but the fact that he did try at all chucks him away from bad guy status..

oh and I just noticed the Yankee comment — I am not going to say anything just — you sox fans really focus on 1 win…

He’s cool in a greasy kind of way and he does really end up laying it all down for Harry in the end there doesn’t he . . . so don’t let tha’ masses get you down!

Snape must’ve had something nice about him because he was friends with Lily for a few years, but then James apparently was a bit of a dick too so maybe she just liked bad men.

Anyway stopping now, I realise I can’t convince any of you:)

By the way – the 16yr old genius in France got off. The publisher would have looked pretty lame pressing charges and attacking the fan base. They admitted that the translation was of professional level – I hope they help channel the kids talent . . . Sheesh – I’d give him work if I knew who he was . . .

On to a more pressing subject….
I will think of one in a bit…
I have about 3,000,000 questions..I wish Jo would write the encyclopedia now..

Gotta say that I don’t think Snape was just “pushing Neville’s bounderies,” though. I think he was being nasty…

I’m lookig forward to hearing what Greg and Penny have to say about all this.

I will agree that Snape is a nasty character when it comes to his interaction with Harry and also with Neville, but bitterness can do bad things to people, as can Love.

As with Neville, could he not say that the people in his life have made him the person he is. Have all not had someone, a teacher, a relative whom we have hated but could easily say that we learnt a lot from them. Sometimes there is that person out there who pushes the boundaries to get the most from you.

I’m only making excuses now because I don’t want to believe that the Snape I have in my mind is that evil

The prophesy absolutely was a turning point for Snape, no question. It was when he was forced to put Lily above his other love– the Dark arts. You could even say it shows growth from his time at Hogwarts, when he couldn’t give up his questionable crowd for Lily. But I just don’t think it can be counted as “good,” or as Snape seeing the error of his ways. He acted for good afterwards, but it was for selfish reasons.

And while he may have been on the right side, I still have to maintain that Snape treated Harry with the virluence that he did because of James. He refused to treat Harry as his own person. And aside from everything else, I will never forgive him for treating Neville like he did. No excuse!

I agree with Michal on this — Snape’s blind obsessive love had him do good for his own gain — in his mind protecting Lily’s son brought him closer to the woman that HIS OWN ACTIONS caused to be hunted by Voldy. Yes Pettigrew’s betrayal was HUGE but Snape’s telling the Dark Lord about the prophecy led to Lily’s death as much as Pettigrew’s actions — how would he have known about it otherwise. I think Snape’s protection was as much out of guilt as anything else..

Although I did like the complexity his love brought as a character it made Snape seem like a person instead of this dark figure in the corner..

He could’ve just gone all and out bad from this point in revenge.

From this point on we only see Snape acting for good, in other words he saw the error of his ways. As far as JK shows, Snape from this point on only acted for DD. Do we know whether he performed anymore nasty things after this point? Apart from Killing DD, but we now know why he did this. I don’t think we ever saw him performing a unforgivable throughout the books?

I think the crimes of Snape and Pettigrew were very different. Pettigrew, as you say, just sold out. “His own stinking skin meant more to him than [Harry's] whole family.” Snape was doing his Death Eaterly duties in reporting the prophesy; it wasn’t personal. I don’t think he cared who it was about or what that might mean for them– until it became clear that Lily was in danger.

This is really the crux of why I don’t see Snape as being all that good. It was all for Lily. If the prophesy had referred to a random Wizarding family, Snape would never have blinked. He never would have told Dumbledore to hide them, never had protected their son after their deaths. It even strikes me as selfish on Snape’s part. He just wanted Lily, period, end of story.

Wow, sorry if that’s kind of harsh…

Re the Longbottoms, we really don’t know if Snape connected the attack on the to the prophesy. Come to think, we don’t really know if they are connected either… never mind!

Between the two characters I see Pettigrew as the worst because to me his betrayal was the worst. He told VM where the Potter’s were only for personal gain. I don’t see the reason that Snape told VM the prophecy as being for personal gain just misguided, maybe to get back at James. Love can do strange things to people at times and Snape was man enough to admit his mistake to DD and to try and make amends by getting DD to hide the Potter’s, even if it all only was for Lily.

Snape is a flawed character like most human beings, maybe I see a little of myself in him so thats why I’m trying so hard to defend him.

As for the Longbottom’s, I really don’t think Snape realised the prophecy could’ve had anything to do with them, please correct me if i’m wrong.

Meg – I have just had a look at SoG after Greg’s promotion on the last podcast, I will go and download now.